S3E3 - Faculty-Student Relationships/Morristown Mission Recap
Summary: In this episode of College Conversations, host Jeff Sherrod, along with president Gregg Garner, engages with students Melanie Flores and Justice Garner to discuss the importance of fostering strong relationships between faculty and students. They share personal experiences highlighting how these connections have positively impacted their academic and personal growth. The conversation emphasizes the role of faculty in providing support, accountability, and mentorship, which are crucial for student success. Listeners will gain insights into how intentional relationships can enhance the college experience and contribute to a supportive learning environment. Join us as we explore the transformative power of faculty-student relationships in shaping a meaningful college journey!
[00:00:05.83] - Jeff Sherrod
Hey, everyone, and welcome back to College Conversations. I'm your host, Jeff Sherrod. I am joined, as always, by the president of the Institute for God, Mr. Gregg Garner. We also get to sit down with a couple students today to talk about developing better faculty student relationships. We're talking to a couple students today about their experience in developing relationships with their teachers. The catalyst that that was in their own development and maturation as students. Students and the advice that they would give to other students to be able to foster those relationships better with their teachers. I think you guys are going to have a great time listening this episode. Let's jump right in. Hey, guys. Welcome to College Conversations. Super happy to have you guys here today. I'd love for you guys just to introduce yourselves. Tell us what year you are in the institute where you're from. Melanie? Yeah. You want to start?
[00:00:59.75] - Melanie Flores
My name is Mel Flores. I am a junior at the institute and I'm from Shreveport, Louisiana.
[00:01:04.51] - Jeff Sherrod
Shreveport. How far is that from like, where? Do we have any reference points there?
[00:01:08.37] - Melanie Flores
So from. From Nashville, it's about nine and a half, ten hours.
[00:01:11.56] - Gregg Garner
What about from New Orleans?
[00:01:12.51] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, that's the one. That's the only one I know from New Orleans. New Orleans.
[00:01:15.98] - Melanie Flores
That's how you say it. It's about like five hours or so.
[00:01:21.54] - Jeff Sherrod
Okay.
[00:01:22.14] - Melanie Flores
Yeah.
[00:01:22.50] - Jeff Sherrod
Nice. Well, welcome, Justice.
[00:01:25.12] - Justice Garner
My name is Justice Garner. I'm a freshman at the Institute and I am from Nashville, Tennessee, born and raised.
[00:01:32.35] - Jeff Sherrod
Here we are.
[00:01:33.04] - Justice Garner
Yes, sir.
[00:01:33.90] - Jeff Sherrod
Well, thanks for joining us today. Yeah. We are talking today about faculty student relationships. When I'm saying faculty, I'll just go and say I'm talking about more than just teachers in the classroom, often talking about the administration as well. Like people that are part of the college who are adults and the kind of relationships that they can have with students, part of the classroom also. One of the things I do want to talk about, even as we get into the episode, is that you guys just came back from a trip yesterday. Yeah. So I'd love to be able to talk about that, too. How did that stand out? Even some of the topics that we're talking about. But to get underway, I wanted to just kind of. This is from David Kinnaman, who people, if they're listening to this, like, man, that guy really quotes David Kinnaman a lot. But listen, he does a lot of research on Christian colleges.
[00:02:18.55] - Gregg Garner
So he's the president of the Barna Research Group. So this is his job.
[00:02:22.59] - Jeff Sherrod
Yes, his job. So you're like, Jeff really says a lot about him, but he wrote this book in 2019, Faith for Exiles. And this is one of the big takeaways that they had when they were talking about working with college students. He said, when we talk to those who attend Christian colleges and universities, they say that one of the best parts of that experience is to get to know and be known by the professors and administration, being invited to have a meal together, getting to know them outside the classroom, getting help sorting out difficulties they face. Students notice the people who care. And this is demonstrated by giving time and attention what he calls the ministry of presence. So I thought that was, you know, and this is where I've done a lot of research on this topic. And this thing that kind of keeps coming back is colleges try to keep on saying, like, all right, let's get our academics up, or let's get this student service up, you know, or some amenity up, all these things, which can be fine. But then the thing that students keep on relating is that if they just had faculty as part of their life, like, you're like, I can have a meal or I can go minister together, serve together, do something outside the classroom. It's one of the biggest indicators for success, even during college and then after college. Right. So let me just read one more, and then I'm going to ask you guys some questions here.
[00:03:38.65] - Gregg Garner
To be fair, you're saying that's a statistical indicator, that there is a market. What success rate for students who said that while they were in college, they had a. How would you define it?
[00:03:54.68] - Jeff Sherrod
They. They had strong relationships with administration and faculty. And they're. And it's often just self reported.
[00:04:00.37] - Gregg Garner
And the. And the data shows that.
[00:04:01.93] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, so there's like, Gallup, Gallup, who does a lot of research in this area as well, about colleges. They did a major study, tens of thousands of participants, both in 2014 and 2019, and they looked at, like, they call it, like Gallup's big six, which are like, what are the six indicators that they found that kind of predict success both during college and then after. Meaning, like, people look back at their college experience and say, that was helpful and that was a good experience and they landed jobs, they were up for promotions, those kind of things. Three of the six indicators they look at are relationships with faculty administration, whether you have, like, some kind of service learning opportunity with them, whether you said that you had a strong relationship with more than them, with more than one of them, if there was a teacher that made you excited about learning. And then even the other ones have to do with, like, mentorship, which is still very much related, you know, like, so, yeah, there. There's. There's. There's data to even back up, like, people that have better relationships with faculty and administration during college do better in life. So.
[00:05:06.08] - Gregg Garner
And.
[00:05:06.38] - Jeff Sherrod
And yeah, unfortunately, one of the things that the data also points out is that this is, like, a perennial area of weakness for colleges. So in 2022, the student voice survey, and this was another major survey they looked at. They kind of asked colleges, like, on these five or six different metrics, other than gallups, the different six things, like, rate your college. And, like, 83% of them had very favorable reviews of academic rigorous. So they were. They were like, my school has academic rigor in terms of communicating course expectations. 70, 77% of them said, yep, that's good. And it kind of goes through different things, but it says building relationships with students. 59% of them said that that's happening. So it's like, of all the things that they reviewed, it was by far the lowest category of students are like, yeah, academic rigor, and they communicate expectations and all these other things. But in terms of building relationships with us, that doesn't happen to the same degree. That happens with other things. So, yeah. So anyway, that's kind of what we're talking about today. You know, for you guys, you guys are in it. And. And I know even, Mel, you have some different experiences, because this isn't justice. You're a freshman. This is your first time doing college before.
[00:06:17.70] - Melanie Flores
Yeah.
[00:06:18.05] - Jeff Sherrod
Now you've. You've done some other college before, so.
[00:06:20.22] - Melanie Flores
Yeah. Yeah.
[00:06:21.06] - Jeff Sherrod
What's. Maybe. Maybe just kind of kick us off here, doing some compare and contrast to your institute experience. Maybe some other call. Another college you went to.
[00:06:28.62] - Melanie Flores
Yeah. So I started coming to the institute in 2022. Before that, I went to a community college in Bossier City, Louisiana. And I was wanting to start there, get a degree of two years, and then transfer to another college. And I have definitely made some comparisons and contrasts from being there now to the Institute. And one that, like, a contrast that really stands out are the. Are the relationships that I have with professors just in the way that they. The professors here at the institute have invested into me and have encouraged me with scripture, with. With correction when I need it. It's always been helpful and just strengthened me as a student and as a person. I've received a lot of help from my professors outside of the classroom with finances, with navigating, budgeting, with just learning to be an adult.
[00:07:27.54] - Jeff Sherrod
Finances, like, giving you advice.
[00:07:28.89] - Melanie Flores
Yes, yeah, yeah. Tips and move forward and Just be a better steward of my resources and even like, plan for things. Like here we have internship and trips, going abroad and how to plan those things out. But if I were at my previous college, that still, that just wasn't happening. I would go to a professor. And I wasn't met with the same intentionality that I received from the professors here. Or even like taking the time outside of the classroom to meet with me and, and dig deeper and push me forward. And that has made like a huge impact. And that's something that has really stood out to me, being here at the institute compared to another college.
[00:08:18.00] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. Awesome. Well, you think? Justice, I know this is your first experience in college, but how has like, maybe even relationships outside the classroom look for you so far?
[00:08:26.31] - Justice Garner
Right. Like, my teachers here are so considerate outside the classroom. It's kind of like mind blowing. You. I kind of get caught off guard sometimes by how much they, like, text me and email me and like, ask me how I'm doing. For me, like, I'm a pretty independent person. So sometimes I'm like, whoa.
[00:08:44.35] - Jeff Sherrod
Like, it feels too much.
[00:08:45.80] - Justice Garner
Yeah, it's like too much. But then I realize, like, how actually helpful it is when I'm. When I give. When I humble myself and let, like, my teachers help me. Because, like, at this school, it's not like we're just learning any other skill or job or it's not just getting any random education. Like, this is the word of God. And it's something that I take very seriously because I base my whole life off the word of God. And the teachers do the same. So when they are teaching us and investing into us, I know that first of all, that's also coming from the Word. And second of all, that they're intentional about bringing that word into everything that they're talking with me about. And when they reach out, it's like, super impactful to me because it's always filled with the Word and God and it's always directing me toward the Word and that's. I always need it. Even though sometimes I'm like, wow, they're really trying to find out how I'm doing. And sometimes I'm like, I don't really want to talk to anyone right now. But at a certain point, it forces you to humble yourself and let a community take care of you. And it enables you to do more for the kingdom and learn the Bible even better. And it's really nice and helpful. One of our faculty and staff for our. She has an office that I go to pretty often. Because I don't know if I could say names, but, like, the direct.
[00:10:23.78] - Jeff Sherrod
I think you're talking about the director of student life.
[00:10:25.45] - Justice Garner
Right, Right. So she'll just call me to her office here, like, let's just. Let's just check up on you. And I'm like, okay. And so I go and we'll just talk about how I'm doing in my life and conflicts that I'm in. And it's just like a time. It's like almost better than therapy at that point because it's like our teachers are so biblically rooted and I can trust them because I'm like, yeah, that's in the word of God, like you are using. It's like they have the authority of the Lord because they're using his Word and it speaks measures into my life. When, like, compared to, like a normal therapy, like, it's more like, how do you feel about this? But they're like, actually keeping me accountable and making sure I'm on the right track. And it's very helpful.
[00:11:09.55] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. I think it's interesting how you're noting, like, you know, one of the research things that comes up as students will often say that they want relationships with faculty and staff, but then if there's like, some accountability, there's also, like, tough.
[00:11:22.92] - Justice Garner
Yeah, yeah.
[00:11:23.33] - Jeff Sherrod
There's a moment maybe where it's like, all right, well, I am definitely seen.
[00:11:27.20] - Justice Garner
Right. But I'm here to get better as a person and I'm here to become someone, not just to do something.
[00:11:33.10] - Melanie Flores
Yeah.
[00:11:33.52] - Justice Garner
So, like, that's what I'm saying. Like, it humbles you for sure, because you're like, I don't want to be on time to that. But, like, then they're like, hey, I noticed you were on time. Like, what's going on? Like, are you alright? It's not just like punishment as soon as you, like, are not on time for something. So it's like, the amount of accountability is really special. And I don't see that too much anywhere else. It's really helpful, even though sometimes it's tough, but, like, you really have to deny your flesh. And like I said, I'm trying to get better as a person. And so it really is helpful.
[00:12:05.90] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:12:06.36] - Justice Garner
Yeah.
[00:12:07.14] - Jeff Sherrod
For you guys, part of your experience so far, I'm just kind of curious. Like, do you think that. Because just as you're saying, people are reaching out. Yeah. And maybe for both you guys, do you think that it's mostly been the faculty being like, hey, I'm going to you, or the students are like, hey, I'd like to have relationships with the faculty. Is it kind of go both ways, or is there one that starts either way?
[00:12:30.02] - Melanie Flores
Yeah, I would say it's either ways. And for me especially, I mean, a part of being seen. I mean, as a student here, as a person, like, you have to put yourself out there. You have to make your. Make your needs known. And that has been so rewarding. Whenever I've reached out to my professors and told them, I'm struggling with this, I need help. And it was hard for me. It was hard to be vulnerable in that way and to humble myself, but when I did, it was so rewarding. And what exactly. They met me with what I needed. They knew what I needed. I didn't know what I needed, but they did and gave me scripture and correction and met me with a lot of grace and prayer and encouraged me, like, throughout, like, consistently as well. Like, would text me or reach out to me, like, hey, how is this going? Or I could text them, like, I reached this goal and they would celebrate it with me. But I had that. While they also reached out, I had to do my part and reach back out too, right?
[00:13:28.89] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. Because, I mean, from a faculty perspective, I'm going to reach out, but if something's going on, you know, we can't read people's minds.
[00:13:35.25] - Justice Garner
Right.
[00:13:35.54] - Jeff Sherrod
People have to feel comfortable. If someone. If you were talking to someone sounds like both you guys have some level of comfortability to talk to faculty, staff. If you were talking to someone, someone else. And, like, I don't know if, you know, I know we're talking about our college here in this situation, but if you were talking to a classmate and be like, I don't know if I should reach out, what do you think I should do? What would be some of the advice that you guys would give?
[00:13:59.59] - Justice Garner
I mean, the way I. You have to get comfortable, for sure. It's not like something you. You just. You just come to the college and you're automatically talking to the teachers about, like, problems you're having. That's not, like, a normal thing. Right. It's not happening. The way I actually did it is when I got diagnosed with Lyme's disease, I got behind on my work, and even, like, pro Dev, like, I got behind on that, and I was just really struggling. And you actually reached out to me, you and the director of student life and my. The product director reached out to me, and you guys wanted to meet me. So, like, I went and met with you, and I got to, like, kind of pour out, like, all that I've been dealing with. And it was, like, a really helpful time. And I didn't want to do it at first because I was like, it's really humbling, like, having to share my issues and why I'm behind on things. But, like, once I did it, like, just being able to tell the truth in that way, it really did set me free. And you guys, like, gave me really good advice and helped me. And ever since then, I've been comfortable to, like, go to my teachers and my professors and be like, hey, I'm behind on this because of this. And not only will they be, like, gracious and be like, all right, we'll give you some more time, but, like, they'll pray with you, and they'll, like, make sure, like, you're getting better in that way. It's super special because that's how I develop that relationship. I kind of almost had to make a mistake first. But, like, as. As someone that has been through that, like, I've been encouraging my friends, like, you can just talk to your teacher. That's why they're there, you know, like.
[00:15:29.32] - Jeff Sherrod
And then you start to learn that there's no students that have no issue.
[00:15:32.12] - Justice Garner
Right, Exactly.
[00:15:33.34] - Jeff Sherrod
Like, I know you, like, have an issue, but it's, like, that's why, you know, it's part of the reason. Right?
[00:15:37.08] - Gregg Garner
Yeah.
[00:15:37.38] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. To grow.
[00:15:38.08] - Melanie Flores
Yeah.
[00:15:38.66] - Gregg Garner
And there's really not going to be a time in life where anybody doesn't have an issue.
[00:15:42.17] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. Also true.
[00:15:43.37] - Gregg Garner
It seems like the people that are the least healthy when going through an issue are the people who have no one to share or who haven't learned what I think some could call the art of vulnerability and learning how to share an issue. It's good that college students get a venue to practice, right?
[00:16:01.82] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. Yeah. It's helpful.
[00:16:03.37] - Melanie Flores
Yeah. Yeah. I was. I was relating a lot to what you're saying, Justice. I had to make a mistake as well. I was just learning a lot of lessons about finances and being a good steward of my money, like I kind of mentioned earlier. But I had just gotten into some debt, and it was no one's fault but my own. And you and the director of Student life reached out to me and met me with just a lot of grace and love and understanding and scripture. And it was very hard for me. It was very difficult. And it was a long period of time of hard work and just going through a lot of even feeling shame, like, feeling like I couldn't look at my professors in the eyes, like I had failed you in some way or disrespected you in some way. Because I had just come from a family that didn't understand a lot about finances. So I was figuring out a lot of it just for the first time. But you helped me and wrote out a plan and things to do and what next steps to take and goals to hit every month to pay off that debt. And I remember I thanked you and you looked at me in the eyes and you're like, yeah, Mel, you're worth it. And that moment has, like, stayed with me. And it really just, it really changed my life because I never had a professor or an adult look at me and say that. And I felt very freed in that moment. And I felt because of, because of that wisdom, because of that you had that belief in me, I felt empowered to be like, yeah, I can work. I can be a student full time and work and pay off this debt and go on internship. And that all happened. I was able to pay off all of that debt and fundraise and go abroad. And it was because of that encouragement and you had that belief in me. And so thank you.
[00:17:53.93] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, of course. That's super meaningful. Thanks for sharing.
[00:17:56.84] - Gregg Garner
Stop crying
[00:17:57.14] - Jeff Sherrod
Right
[00:17:57.93] - Justice Garner
At the school, it's like, it doesn't feel like our teachers are just doing their job because it's their job. That's not what it feels like. It feels like they're really investing into us. Like, I constantly feel like I'm receiving and I'm receiving and I'm receiving. And it's like, super helpful because, you know, they're on your side, like, at that point. And that's like one of the most powerful things is when someone, you feel like someone's on your side, you know, and you feel like someone wants you to do well. Because I know in a lot of schools from high school to college, like, people like, feel like their teachers want to fail them or want to see them mess up or whatever. But, like, the kind of support that I feel for my teachers is, like, unmatched. And it's like, it really helps me and my schoolwork because I know that they have my back. Like, they just want me to learn the Bible. And it's like they, they know how important it is for our lives. And it, it helps so much because, like, okay, they're on my team, they're on my side. Like, they're really going to help me. They don't just want to see me, like, mess up, you know, like, it’s. It's good when you can trust someone that is teaching you, you know.
[00:19:09.11] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. Gregg, let me ask you this. Like, let me just voice the critic here for a little bit. And let's say. Let's say someone's listening and they're saying, like, all right, that all sounds good, but isn't college the time to, like, cut the cord? And you guys need to, like, you know, it's helpful to fail and you develop some independence and, yeah, maybe you fail and maybe you don't get it. Right. But, you know, that was the. That was a good lesson you could have learned. Sounds like you're getting too much help, you know, something like that. Well, what would you. What would you. I'm interested. What would you say the reason?
[00:19:41.60] - Gregg Garner
I mean, sounds like a very masculine criticism. That's the first thing I'm thinking about.
[00:19:46.11] - Justice Garner
Yeah.
[00:19:46.82] - Gregg Garner
I think a mom would feel very different.
[00:19:49.31] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, I think that's probably true.
[00:19:51.24] - Gregg Garner
I get. I get that. On a pragmatic level, for families, having a kid in the house is a financial weight to carry.
[00:19:59.14] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:19:59.59] - Gregg Garner
And so when they do leave the house, that concept of cutting the cord, cutting them from the life supply, seems to feel like alleviating. But these are. These are still young people whose literal cognitive capacity, their physiology, their biology is still developing.
[00:20:17.31] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:20:18.23] - Gregg Garner
And perhaps it's. It's the most crucial time in their whole life in terms of that fulcrum position between being a child and then becoming a adult who participates in the world and history and. And contributing with the energy they have during those next three decades where they can really do something great in the world. So, yeah, I hear that criticism, and I think that if people want to do that with their kid, they're obviously free to do that. I wouldn't want to do that with my kid. I think that even if you were to look at biologically, the concept of cutting the cord, most moms who get educated on birth don't even want you to mess with the cord until they've held the baby. Help them to calm down. Help them to put them on their chest, skin to skin, so that their heart regulates to the rhythm of the mother's heart so that they have a sense of safety. I mean, it's a rather shocking transition.
[00:21:17.56] - Jeff Sherrod
Right, right.
[00:21:18.30] - Gregg Garner
To go from the womb into the real world. And I think in the same way, to take these young people and just throw them out into the world, it's shocking to their system, which is why I think institutions do do what they end up doing, which is figuring out ways to both matriculate and graduate students without ever having to be responsible for them.
[00:21:40.96] - Jeff Sherrod
Right.
[00:21:41.65] - Gregg Garner
Because there's one thing to be responsible for a student's outcomes related to what gets put on a syllabus. There's another thing to be responsible for a student's outcome related to what kind of person they become. Yeah, like you can post statistically an institution's academic results. We graduated this many students, they had these types of GPAs. But hardly is an institution going to post what those students became. I mean, you have. You have really great institutions producing really not so great people. Yeah, but those not so great people get umbrella underneath a stat that just says graduated with a certain GPA or a certain degree. So if you're building the kingdom of Go, you're not primarily concerned with student outcomes in terms of mere academics. You're concerned with the workmanship of God, which is building up his people. And in that case, you're going to be looking at whether their person aligns with the person of Christ. And we take that stewardship very seriously. So while I understand there comes a time to cut the cord, I don't. I don't think it's as healthy to do it so abruptly. Which is why we really encourage parents to be involved with us even as their students are in college. And if you did like a preview day with us and parents sit in there, I'm looking the parents in the eyes and saying, hey, listen, here's some tips for this next phase of life. You're not done with them. They still need you and they still need your support. And there's a hostile world that's trying to make them feel like they're not somebody unless they can do this all by themselves. But then it's like, who are we listening to? The very God who said it's not good for human beings to be alone. And then now we're going, wait a second. They need to be alone so they can learn.
[00:23:41.03] - Jeff Sherrod
Right?
[00:23:42.09] - Gregg Garner
Like, of all the things God says that's good in creation, there's this one thing that's not. And it's the aloneness of a person. So you got all kinds of students matriculating into these prestigious universities of a variety of type, and then they get there and they're alone, and that is not good. And the least that could happen are faculty, administration, staff trying to help them integrate. But then also the horizontals that get created in friendships. And that leadership is responsible for cultivating an atmosphere for that to happen. There's so much, especially these days for these guys, the knowledge. And we've talked about this before. Knowledge is easy to access now.
[00:24:27.33] - Justice Garner
Yeah.
[00:24:27.74] - Gregg Garner
These guys can access knowledge so quickly going into the classroom and just regurgitating knowledge that they could have found on a, on a real good prompt on Grok3. I mean, you know, they're going to, they're going to be on top of it. And it's the, the generation that's in, you know, I'm stereotyping, but it's a broad generality, like people who are in leadership in the post secondary education space and then the parents who are putting their kids into it. I don't think many of them have taken the time to effectively evaluate what age we live in. And that what these guys need now is not just knowledge. They need to learn how to sort through the knowledge. They need to learn how to become discerning young adults. And that comes through nurturing and cultivating and it's an active process that has them. Yeah, Even, even both of you noted it was a disciplinary action that unlocked a new freedom for you in terms of being able to share and open up. But when you have people who prefer to just use a report card to communicate the discipline, which is an. In operations, we'd call it a lag measure. Right. There's nothing you can do about it.
[00:25:48.14] - Justice Garner
You wouldn’t learn anything from that.
[00:25:49.57] - Gregg Garner
Yeah. Like it just tell. Usually what tells a student is you're dumb and this is a subject matter you can't do. Or for a student who then can, can crack the formula, which is this is the knowledge they're going to spill into me. I'm just going to learn the knowledge, regurgitate the knowledge. Yeah, they just get a paper when they're done instead of getting the experience that builds them up in such a way that they feel part of the history that they live in, which is so important. I, I think if I was to add to that critic, because I was thinking about this too, I think it's so interesting that you have people like Gallup or, or Barna who've done the research and have discovered this is what students want. But at the same time, because it's so unique when students get it, the criticism is not even articulate. Right. What people say is, that's weird.
[00:26:46.26] - Jeff Sherrod
Right.
[00:26:47.24] - Gregg Garner
That's weird to have dinner with your faculty. That's weird to go on, on a trip with, with your teachers. That's weird. Like they can't articulate what's weird about it. And usually what they mean is, it's not my experience. That's not my experience. And because it's not their Experience, it's weird. And if you can get enough and bad. Yeah, it becomes bad if you get enough. People like bandwagoning that argument now. Now it's an ambush. That makes the very thing, statistically, students, when they self report, right. Likely anonymously, so they can speak their mind, they don't want it, and then people get it. And it's like, no. Like, I've had people come up to me and say, you know, how come at your school it seems like everybody knows each other. That's weird. This is a real sentence. They said, you know, most schools, teachers don't really know the students, and the students don't really know the teachers, and it makes for a better learning environment. And I asked them to give me their source information.
[00:27:45.63] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, I'd love to see that. And they didn't see that.
[00:27:47.50] - Gregg Garner
They said, it just seems that way. And a lot of people would agree with me. And so we live in bandwagon fallacy, dude. We just. Yeah, bandwagon. We live in a generation, though, where people post an opinion, and the only thing people can do is either like it. And you know how many people aren't even reading the opinion? They just like the person that's on there. They saw a post and they're like, now they're just thinking about themselves. I don't want them to think I don't think well about them. Thumbs up, little heart, whatever it is. And then they move on. And now the person feels affirmed in their resolve, which had no rationale or reason behind it, no actual application of logic. It's just a feeling that now gets confirmed. So I do think it's interesting that when you can have what it is, that because of God's word, we've been able to cultivate in obedience a safe environment for young people to access the wisdom of those who've gone before them and to do it in a way that it does go. It goes both ways. Like, not only do we bring you guys accountability, you bring accountability too, you know, and this is where you want to go next. We just came back and I was on this trip with you guys to Morristown in East Tennessee. And, you know, while we're implementing all of the wise considerations for having adults or professors and teachers going on trips with kids, you know, in terms of rooming assignments and, you know, not putting anybody in any situation that could lead to any criticism or weirdness, for lack of a better term there, I'll go ahead and apply all that being said, being present with the students in this alternative environment, that is outside of the classroom, yet embodying the virtue that's being taught in the classroom becomes in and of itself an enhanced classroom. It's not just the students hearing from the lecturer or the professor now. It's a student now observing the professor or the lecturer. Live that out. And, and that is a next level lesson. But I know that for most institutions, you and I have talked about this. My experience. The only professor I ever had a meal with was my Greek teacher and he threw a Super bowl party. And he was a sweet guy, he was rather odd and, and it was just one time, one moment, one evening. And even though he was a weird dude, I thought he was so cool after that just because he, he let us hang out at his house and he, and it was weird watching him in like a, a hat and like eating chips on his, his recliner chair. It was like the weirdest.
[00:30:34.46] - Jeff Sherrod
I went over to one professor's house when I was in undergrad and we watched the movie 13. Do you remember this movie?
[00:30:40.72] - Gregg Garner
It's like about, with Antonio Banderas and he's. Oh, that's 13th Warrior.
[00:30:46.13] - Jeff Sherrod
No. Yeah, this is like where there's this 13 year old girl who becomes like.
[00:30:50.29] - Gregg Garner
Way too 13 going on 30.
[00:30:52.08] - Jeff Sherrod
No, no, it wasn't a comedy. It was like I felt like what am I watching?
[00:30:55.82] - Gregg Garner
Oh, they made a musical on this one. Yeah, I know what you're talking about. Yes, yes.
[00:30:59.70] - Jeff Sherrod
It's like this girl who grows up way too fast and has, you know, illicit relationships with older people. She's 13 and it's a movie about.
[00:31:06.92] - Justice Garner
Are you sure that's not 13 going on 30? I agree. It's also creepy, but yeah.
[00:31:14.60] - Gregg Garner
So that's what you all watch?
[00:31:15.50] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, that's what we watched. That was weird. He's weird again.
[00:31:19.93] - Gregg Garner
Yeah, but going on this mission trip together and then them being around their professors and getting to be in an environment where it's now about the application of the things you're learning in the classroom in my opinion is a very healthy experience. And then getting to have some of the responsibilities that leaders would have offloaded into an opportunity for a student to now practice while they have the covering of the person in authority who knows what they're doing. A lot of these student run organizations, I think, you know, they'll, they'll take someone like mel, you're about 25, 26, 25, 25 years old. They'll take someone like you and they will give you the full on responsibilities. They'll, they'll train you maybe for a week or two, and then, like, go get them. And you're just out there faking it till you make it. And that. That's. That while that's common, that's not, in my opinion, the best approach for doing something like that. It's much better to start you off a little earlier, be with a person who does it. They give you one or two responsibilities within the scope of the dozen they have, and they begin to process and offload as you develop. And it should be so natural that a certain point, I've even seen students say, like, I've just always known how to do this. Now, that's not true. They got scaffolded right into being, feeling like that, thinking like that. But that's the product of a effective educational institution or trajectory of educational institution.
[00:32:53.99] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, yeah.
[00:32:54.57] - Justice Garner
I mean, you even see, like, Jesus and disciples, like, they literally lived with him and followed him around everywhere, ate with him, like, saw him around his mother. Like, you see him see them in such, like, personal venues, and it, like, you can see how much it helped them because, like, you know, I want to see my. My teacher live out what they teach me. You know, it makes it so much more impactful when, you know, they're not hypocritical about what they're giving you, especially when they're teaching you the word of God. Because it's like, we take that so seriously here. And it's like, you know, that that's our lives. And if they are taking it seriously and they're doing what they're teaching us, it's so inspiring to me. And it's. It's so helpful when I'm learning because I'm like, okay, they're doing it, and I. I can do it, too.
[00:33:37.92] - Gregg Garner
Yeah.
[00:33:38.25] - Justice Garner
And I'm going to trust them. And.
[00:33:39.49] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, it's good. Yeah. I mean, even I'm. You know, I'm thinking about Paul writing to Timothy in second Timothy, his classical discipleship book. Right. You've observed my teaching. And so he says that. But then also my aim of life, my conduct, my faithfulness, even amidst all the persecutions. You know, he goes into this, like, litany of thing where it's, you've known me.
[00:33:59.14] - Gregg Garner
They have a personal relationship.
[00:34:00.59] - Jeff Sherrod
Personal relationship. It's not just, I knew you. He doesn't just stop with you. You observe my teachings on going with that. And so, yeah, let's talk about Morristown here for a little bit, though. Maybe justice, you can give us a little summary of what the trip was.
[00:34:13.76] - Justice Garner
Yeah. So we got there. It's Morristowns in East Tennessee. It's right next to Knoxville. Small little town, but they got a lot of pride there. It's really great. It's majority Hispanic community, but there. There is a lot of immigrants that live there. And we work with our sister church down there. And where we went, the institute students went alongside the academy, the K12 school, their mission trip. So I went alongside them and we did on Saturday. It was about three days, on Saturday we completed, like, 18 projects or something. Like 19 projects. And we went like, 19 places.
[00:34:55.13] - Melanie Flores
Yeah.
[00:34:55.65] - Justice Garner
And we had like, maybe 40 to 50 kids, and we did so much. I went to this place called Hope and Thrive Academy. It's with. There are adults with special needs, and I got to go and I got to lead worship for them, and we got to put on a big spring break celebration for them. And for me, it was really impactful. Like, it's like almost. You're looking in, like, to the face. The face of God, like, when you look into their eyes, because you just know the Lord's with them because they're in this. Like, these people are almost forgotten. Like, these people with disabilities. And when you actually spend time with them, you see, like, the Lord's with them, and it's a Christian institution, too, which is really cool. Like, they love worship. And you just see, like, you know, this. This is where Jesus would be at. This is where Jesus was, you know, like, with the broken and with. With the needy. And it was just a really great time where I got to invest and learn their stories and look them in the eyes as they. They get to tell their truth, which is not something they often get to do besides to their, you know, caretakers, which is only like four of them for like, 50 adults. So it was really special. But that's like one of the. The major projects that we did when we were there. We built decks, we put on kids camps, we put on, like, celebrations for the church and the community. We did worship times. So there was a lot going on, and there's a lot of moving parts, and we had to plan a lot of it out, but we also had to, you know, just stay on the move and just. It was like the Israelites. Like, the cloud kept moving, fire kept moving. We just had to go. So it was. It was really fun. But, yeah, he was there and Mel was there. So I guess you guys can share any more that.
[00:36:42.65] - Melanie Flores
Yeah, yeah.
[00:36:43.21] - Justice Garner
From your perspective.
[00:36:44.17] - Melanie Flores
The service project that I was on was called Luke 14 Ministries, and they also. They're connected with the church and their Mission is to all year, they plan a huge celebration with a theme and decorations where they invite adults one day for adults with special needs to come out, and then the next day that they celebrate is for children with special needs. And they throw this huge party, like from like almost the entire church building. It's like all decked out and decorations. And they were sharing with us that it's so important that they do this because if we're having a celebration or dinner or banquet, like it says in Luke 14 that you should invite the lame, the poor, the needy, the disabled. Those are the people. That's God's heart. And they've been doing it for a long time. And they were expecting like a thousand people this year. And our group, we didn't get to see the people that they invite, but we got to help make the decorations for the party. And it was so special because we got to see some videos of past parties that they put on. And they shared with us how much it helped them making those decorations to make this time really special for them. Most of them, they share just their excitement and even how thankful they are because no one invites them to things like this. They don't have an opportunity to go to a party and dance and sing and have fun. And so it's really special for them. And it ended up turning into a really powerful time of prayer. There was a lady named Emily on their staff and she shared that she experienced a recent loss of a co worker at her job. And the academy students. I was with some of the high school girls and they just came around her and prayed for her and encouraged her and it was, it was so special. She shared like a testimony at the end of the time how that just uplifted her and she felt very encouraged by that time.
[00:38:48.51] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah.
[00:38:48.80] - Melanie Flores
So it was really special. That's awesome.
[00:38:50.84] - Jeff Sherrod
I think one of the things that's unique, I mean, obviously going. It sounds like a wonderful trip. One of the things I think makes it unique is that you guys didn't just go. Greg was saying, we're not just sending you out. You guys went with multiple, either faculty or staff of the college that were there with you. And what was it was your experience like they were in a different spot and then they sent you guys out to do.
[00:39:09.80] - Justice Garner
No, no, they were, they were with us. I even tested fight at the end of the trip about one of the academy teachers. She's the vice principal of the high school. And like, I. I would just like, this woman is everywhere. She's like hands in the dirt like working hard. And it's such an inspiration. But like, yeah, like our, our teachers are, are staying up late doing Bible studies and waking up early to help make breakfast and to help me like, organize people. And because we were the institute, we were more delegators and the academy kids were more the like working a lot. And so like the. My teachers would really like, help me and give me direction and show me how they do things. And it was, Everyone was hands on. It was all hands on deck the entire trip. It was really cool.
[00:39:57.21] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. Kind of going back to what even we quoted that Kinnaman quote. I quote at the beginning. Like, you can have a meal with someone, but this is like a meal times 10. Right. Multiple meals. But then you're also serving with your.
[00:40:07.55] - Justice Garner
Exactly.
[00:40:08.11] - Jeff Sherrod
You're worshiping with them, you're praying together. You're doing like life together.
[00:40:12.01] - Justice Garner
Yeah, it's like going on a mission like that. There's really no better way to bond with someone than doing the work of the Lord. Like there's. I've never been like, I've been on so many sports teams, I've been in bands and they all bond you. I've been in musicals. All those things bond you. But like, I've never felt more like a part of a body and a part of a unit than when I'm on mission. And being on mission with our teachers, like, we are so unified and it makes it just. When we all come together, it's beautiful. Yeah.
[00:40:44.32] - Jeff Sherrod
And it's gonna. I'm guessing, if you can correct if I'm wrong, it's gonna change. You're gonna have classes now with those professors next semester, but it's gonna feel a little different. Right?
[00:40:51.71] - Gregg Garner
Right.
[00:40:51.92] - Melanie Flores
Yeah, man.
[00:40:52.40] - Jeff Sherrod
We just did something together. We're united. I'm gonna end with this question here. If you guys were looking at, you know, faculty or staff on your trip, what's something that you would say that they modeled about discipleship that maybe you can't quite see the same way in the classroom?
[00:41:07.84] - Justice Garner
I think I'll go first.
[00:41:10.13] - Melanie Flores
Yeah, go ahead.
[00:41:11.46] - Justice Garner
They tell the story of like the leaders at like 1am that they had finished all their work. Like, all the kids are going to bed. I'm putting some of the academy kids to bed, helping them get their two minute showers and get out and go to sleep. And like the, Some, some of the teachers told the story of like the teachers that night at 1am Just did a Bible study. They just like studied the word at night. And hearing that was so inspiring to me because I Was just like, man, these teachers really care about God's word. And honestly, that's why this is working. Like, that's why they're able to give it their all and stay up from sun up to sundown teaching the Bible and organizing people and getting these people to like, really build the kingdom and that. That's why this is working because they're so invested into the Word and even when people aren't looking and that's like, that kind of integrity is. Is really special.
[00:42:05.32] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah, that's cool. Thanks.
[00:42:06.98] - Melanie Flores
Yeah. Getting to work with the professors and even academy teachers, the. This trip, it just reminded me of the body passage from First Corinthians 12 and how they all just like we made up the different parts and made us into one body and all. Seeing them all being so mission with everyone, having this one goal in mind, to serve. To serve people of Morristown, to serve the Lord was so special. And I got to work closely with one of the academy teachers doing hospitality. And she's just so wonderful. And she would wake up so early to get breakfast prepared, to get everything ready for everyone before they got up. And she just had so much joy from when she got up to when she went to sleep. And even like in times where we would like, go to the grocery store and get supplies for the next meal, she would use that time while driving and like, answering, like, I was helping her answer text messages and figuring out what location we need to go to, just all the things that she was busy with. But she didn't, she didn't just focus on those things or let those things be like, what she was just focusing on. She really ministered to me, like, even in those car rides, and encouraged me with scripture and asked me intentional questions. And I just, I really cherished that time that I got to even learn from her. Like, she. She gave me tips. She was like, I. I really think that you have a gifting of hospitality. And if you want to keep doing this long term, this is what I've learned, which was so helpful and then even gave me just lessons from life that she's learned. And that was really special.
[00:43:46.26] - Jeff Sherrod
Yeah. Yeah, that's great. I know I should say, you know, I think that that's a part of our culture here, is that we want to be. Have relationships with students. You know, this is something that, Greg, you've modeled from the very beginning. You're not just a professor here, you're also the president. You're going on the same trip, you know, with other people and modeling the kind of discipleship model that says the way that we're going to disciple these young people is to live life together. And that's. We could talk about a number of things that we've done as a college to say this is because this is modeled in Jesus. We're going to make intentional institutional efforts.
[00:44:22.07] - Gregg Garner
Yeah. And I think that's key. And justice had brought that up. Like, we don't want to deviate from the model that Jesus gave. And the model that he gave is something we have to continually evaluate up against whatever models we're implementing. Right. And then we have to realign whatever it is that we're doing to what it was that he did, even if it's not popular anymore, even if it is something that people would call weird or different. That's part of the picking up of the cross. And I'm so thankful for our faculty administration staff, both at the K12 and at the college, because you have people who genuinely believe that the building of the kingdom of God is the development of people and developing people with just the transmission of knowledge isn't. There's not even data to show that retention of that knowledge is anything that sticks. But there's so much evidence when a person can testify, just like you were able to hear Pastor Sherrod, that there's this moment based upon something he said due to an interaction that maybe even started out as a disciplinary action related to something you couldn't control. Like you said, your family wasn't necessarily financially literate. So this was a new thing for you.
[00:45:45.30] - Melanie Flores
Yeah.
[00:45:45.76] - Gregg Garner
But then it culminated in you having a better vision for how God sees you as someone worth the time and the energy. And to model that and create that for students is should and should be a goal for any Christian institution.
[00:46:04.23] - Jeff Sherrod
Absolutely.
[00:46:04.59] - Gregg Garner
If you're not a Christian institution, do whatever you want. You're a Christian institution. You. You gotta. You gotta do things according to God's word. And I'm just very thankful that we can hear students testify to that happen.
[00:46:17.86] - Jeff Sherrod
Amen. Well, thanks so much for joining us, guys. That was great, great conversation. So happy about all the work that happened, even this weekend, and looking forward to wonderful things ahead.
[00:46:25.53] - Justice Garner
Yes, sir.
[00:46:25.98] - Jeff Sherrod
Thanks.
[00:46:26.42] - Justice Garner
Thank you so much.
[00:46:27.48] - Jeff Sherrod
Thanks for joining us today on College Conversations. Please, like, subscribe share this episode with others. If you guys have a comment, we would love to hear from you. If you want to learn more about our work, you can visit us at theinstituteforgod.edu. Until then, we'll see you guys next time.
